The Use of Limestone Solution (น้ำปูนใส) in Thai Cooking
>> Tuesday, August 3, 2010

Limestone (more accurately slaked lime) solution is traditionally used in quite a few Thai recipes. The same limestone paste with a curiously pink hue was part of the betel chewing culture in the olden days and, therefore, a household ingredient. Tinted limestone paste (puun daeng or ปูนแดง) is mixed with water and left undisturbed to allow the limestone particles to settle at the bottom thereby creating a clear separation between the limestone itself and the translucent solution. It's the alkalinity of the clear limestone solution that Thai cooks have used to create enduring crispiness in fried batter or pastry/dough as well as firm, crunchy texture in pickled or candied fruits or vegetables.
Much of the information in this post has been contributed by my chemist aunt whose gentle spirit and generosity have been such a great example to me and to whom I owe greatly for enlightening me in matters of life and science.

Here are some facts about the kind of limestone used in Thai cooking:
- The acidity of turmeric offsets the alkalinity of limestone making it safer to chew.
- Betel chewers generally regard the addition of turmeric as an improvement to the taste and fragrance of limestone paste. The pink color, therefore, is only an unintentional byproduct created by the interaction between turmeric and limestone.

- After a vigorous shake, the limestone particles sink to the bottom immediately. Once shaken, potent limestone is supposed to stay suspended for at least 20 minutes before sinking to the bottom.
- When not in use, limestone solution that is still potent will have tiny white flakes floating on the surface. The absence of these little white flakes means the limestone is no longer suitable to use in the recipe.

In the past, I have introduced a few batter-fried dishes to you wherein limestone solution would have been used. Instead, a mixture of some form of liquid and baking soda is called for. This is because baking soda, when mixed with water, represents the closest thing to limestone. The two are not interchangeable as baking soda or Sodium Bicarbonate (NaHCO3) does not exactly replicate the effects of limestone, and cannot be used with success in some applications in which limestone solution is used, e.g. pickling liquid. But in the case of batter-fried dishes, baking soda, thanks to its alkalinity, can be used to achieve an acceptable level of the much-desired crispiness and lightness.
Batter-fried recipes from the archives:
Crispy-Fried Soft-Shell Crabs
Light and Crispy Sweet Potato Fritters with Thai Sweet Chilli Sauce
Thai-Style Fried Sweet Potatoes with Thai Sweet Chilli Sauce
Thai Fried Sweet Potato Balls (ขนมไข่นกกระทา)



17 comments:
Quite interesting
The pictures really make me want to try the pink limestone. That, and I love crunchy fried food. Is it right to assume you need just a teaspoon or so in your batter?
prettyPeas - Actually, no. Limestone solution (the clear water you get after the limestone particles have settled, not the limestone itself) replaces the fat-free liquid (most of the time water or seltzer or carbonated water) which the batter recipe calls for. For example, if a batter recipe calls for 1 cup water and 2 teaspoons baking soda, you can replace both with 1 cup of limestone solution.
While I think this is a fascinating entry I'm disappointed because it doesn't actually say how one would use limestone solution in various recipes and it doesn't indicate why it's better than baking soda. Your insights and knowledge are formidable but this post, to me at least, lacks context.
rapier - This post is part of the Thai pantry series in which I introduce different ingredients used in Thai cooking, most of the time without including any recipes. It's sort of like the introduction to ingredients you find at the beginning of most cookbooks. It's the subsequent recipe posts, to be linked up with the pertinent ingredient posts, that will tell you how and how much such and such ingredients are used.
I got a lineup of limestone-related recipes planned for the future, and the information on the way in which limestone is used as well as how much will be part of each of those recipes. The purpose of this post is to introduce an ingredient so that I won't have to repeat any of this every time I write a recipe that calls for limestone.
This is so Harold McGee - love it!
I had a doubt when a kid if to choose chemistry or engineer, chose the last, but in my heart adore all the chemical process in everything, more in food. I didn’t know about limestone and less its chem-properties… very interesting!! :)
Cheers,
Gera
Interesting post!
Is this limestone also used to preserve my so much loved 100-years-old-eggs?
Dorrie - Yep. Calcium hydroxide (not in the turmeric-tinted form like this, though) is what is used to make those eggs.
so--Leela--for the 1 cup of solution of water and lime paste that you might use to replace the 2 tsp.baking soda and cup of liquid, say water, in a given recipe would you use 2 tsp also of stiff lime paste? Approximately?
Just bought some paste at the Rice and Spice for fun.
Thanks!
Vernassa4 - actually, you never want to use the actual limestone paste in the recipe. What you want to use is the clear solution that you get from mixing the paste with plain water and after the paste has sunk to the bottom of the jar. I'd dump all of the limestone paste you have bought into a glass jar, mix it with plain water (about 2-3 times the amount of limestone paste), shake the jar, and let the paste sink to the bottom. Then measure out a cup of clear liquid to use in a recipe. Keep the limestone in the jar like that and replenish the water as needed.
Thanks for this entry. There's almost no writing online about the use of limestone in SE Asian cooking. I just tried to make banh lot (Vietnamese name for lod chong) and the Vietnamese recipe calls for limestone water.
A Viet lady told me that the limestone water will make the lod chong noodles "crispier" but I'm trying to understand what that means. The noodles themselves are chewy, soft, and wet. How can limestone make them more "crispy?"
OKFJ - I'm actually testing/refining a recipe for log chong, and I've indeed found that the use of limestone solution really does help create lod chong that holds its shape better (after being boiled) and has a better, chewier texture (instead of doughy, soft, and mealy).
This is kind of like noodles. Noodles made with alkaline solution similar to limestone solution, according to the old Chinese tradition, is more "bouncy," for lack of a better way to describe it.
So I think "crispy" is not the right word. The idea that the lady wanted to communicate could be that limestone solution creates the "bounciness" of the finished product.
All you have to do is follow the recipe that you have, replacing the liquid in the dough with equal amount of limestone solution. That should do it.
Good information that I could not find anywhere else on the net. I have pickling lime and wanted to know if I can use it to make limewater for these noodles:
http://lifeinmexico.wordpress.com/2009/11/17/noodles-oh-how-i-love-thee/
Yes I can! Thank you!
If turmeric (ka-min) and slaked lime (phun) actually go well together (in that they are a good mixture for making a betel chew), why is the Thai saying "ขมิ้นกับปูน" ("turmeric and slaked lime") used to describe things that are incompatible, like fire and water? Much thanks.
tjbroccoli - The saying is based on the fact that when two strong entities come together their differences create a reaction -- often one that weakens each other. You put two bullheaded, opinionated, vocal personalities together, you're bound to see how they affect each other ways that are visible to others. This is the case when turmeric meets slaked lime. It's true that the reaction between the two ends up serving the betel chewer well, but the saying doesn't focus on that aspect. It's about the reaction. This is how I see it.
Good question.
Thank you very much for your response, Admin (Leela?).
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